In this candid and wide-ranging episode of Center of the Universe, Mercury welcomes Chief Black Horse for a conversation about colonization, political division, Indigenous wisdom, authoritarianism, spirituality, and the path to peace.
Beginning with the unrest in Los Angeles and the response from the federal government, Chief Black Horse places the current American political climate within a much longer history of colonialism, domination, fear, oppression, and social control. He explores how these patterns continue to influence modern politics and challenges the Western tendency to understand the world through opposition—light against darkness, one political party against another, and one group against another.
Drawing from Lakota teachings and Indigenous perspectives, Chief Black Horse offers a different way of understanding conflict. Rather than seeing other people as enemies or outsiders, he invokes the principle of Mitákuye Oyás’iŋ—“all my relations”—and invites listeners to recognize the interconnectedness of humanity.
The conversation then develops into a spirited philosophical exchange about the present moment, the nature of time, personal history, and collective healing. Mercury argues that only the present moment truly exists, while Chief Black Horse makes the case that understanding our past is necessary if we hope to recognize harmful patterns and create a different future.
Their disagreement opens into a larger discussion of addiction recovery, human conditioning, prophecy, karma, belief, faith, language, and spiritual consciousness. Although Mercury and Chief Black Horse remain committed to different perspectives, their exchange demonstrates the possibility of engaging in passionate disagreement without losing respect, compassion, or human connection.
Ultimately, the conversation returns to shared ground: lasting political, social, and spiritual peace cannot be created through government or institutions alone. Peace must also begin within each person through self-acceptance, emotional healing, forgiveness, unconditional love, and reconciliation.
Episode Highlights
00:00 — America at an Inflection Point
Mercury welcomes Chief Black Horse and opens with reflections on the unrest in Los Angeles, the federal government’s response, and the deeper issues of poverty, education, political power, and social inequality.
01:25 — Colonization, Oppression and the Politics of Control
Chief Black Horse connects the current political climate to the longstanding history of colonization in North America. He discusses domination, coercion, fear-based leadership, and the continued suppression of marginalized communities.
04:15 — Are Light and Darkness Really at War?
Mercury introduces his philosophy of light, darkness, and the present moment. Chief Black Horse challenges the Western tendency to frame opposites as enemies, suggesting that light and darkness exist in a natural and interconnected dance.
06:10 — Lakota Wisdom and “All My Relations”
Drawing upon the Lakota phrase Mitákuye Oyás’iŋ, Chief Black Horse offers an Indigenous alternative to political polarization. He invites listeners to see humanity as one family rather than dividing people into allies and adversaries.
09:20 — American History, Monarchy and Authoritarianism
The conversation turns to the American Revolution, the structure of the United States government, political loopholes, authoritarian leadership, and the consequences of failing to learn from history.
12:00 — White Supremacy, Social Systems and Political Participation
Chief Black Horse discusses attacks on healthcare, diversity initiatives, and social protections. He also emphasizes civic engagement, voting, and the responsibility of ordinary people to participate in the political process.
15:20 — Does the Past Really Exist?
Mercury argues that the past and future do not possess an independent reality and that the eternal present is the only place where healing, transformation, and peace can occur.
19:10 — Addiction Recovery, Conditioning and Personal History
Chief Black Horse uses addiction recovery to explain why examining past behavior and personal conditioning can help people recognize destructive patterns and make healthier choices.
20:40 — Healing Through the Present Moment
Mercury reflects on his experience of overcoming marijuana addiction and maintains that personal transformation occurs through awareness, choice, and action in the present.
22:00 — Indigenous Prophecy, Karma and the Future
The discussion expands into Indigenous spirituality, visions, prophecy, and Buddhist understandings of karma. Mercury and Chief Black Horse debate whether the future exists independently or only becomes real when experienced in the present.
23:25 — Belief, Faith and the Power of Language
A disagreement about the meaning of belief becomes a broader exploration of spirituality, faith, thought, and the limitations of language.
26:05 — Communication, Precision and Emotional Intensity
The two speakers explore the difference between anger and passion, denotation and connotation, and the importance of using language carefully when discussing complex political and spiritual ideas.
27:35 — How to Disagree Without Losing Connection
Mercury reflects on the trust and mutual respect that have developed through more than five years of conversations with Chief Black Horse. Their exchange demonstrates how people can disagree deeply while remaining connected.
28:50 — Inner Peace, Forgiveness and Collective Healing
Chief Black Horse suggests that political violence and social conflict reflect the internal warfare carried by individuals. Lasting peace begins with self-acceptance, unconditional love, forgiveness, healing, and reconciliation.
29:40 — Closing and Preview of the Continuing Conversation
Mercury closes the episode and invites listeners to continue exploring these themes in the next part of the conversation.